Ep8: How to Build your Personal Brand like Richard Branson with Fleur Brown

Dec 15, 2019

What is your personal brand?

That’s what I’m exploring this week with my very special guest Fleur Brown, who has worked with Richard Branson and just released her new book The Business of Being YOU – Personal Brand Secrets of Celebrities and CEO’s.

In my conversation with Fleur we cover a wide range of topics including how to build a minimum viable personal brand, how your personal backstory is also your businesses backstory and writing the perfect LinkedIn bio.

So please enjoy this special personal branding episode with Fleur Brown.

What you will learn

  • Personal branding lessons from working with Richard Branson
  • How to start building your own personal brand
  • How to build a minimum viable personal brand
  • Grow your message with a human face
  • How your backstory is your businesses backstory
  • How to write the perfect LinkedIn bio
  • Lessons from being a Co-Founder of TEDx Sydney

Resources mentioned in this episode

Afterpay

Nick Molnar

Seth Godin – Talker’s block

TEDx Sydney

Tech Sydney

Launch Group

Take a Zambesi course with Fleur

Slack (check out the best Slack marketing group Online Marketing Geniuses)

Joe Allen

Evan Williams

 

Book recommendations

The Business of Being YOU: Personal Brand Secrets of CEOs and Celebrities by Fleur Brown

This Is Marketing by Seth Godin

Back, After the Break by Osher Günsberg

 

What business you would build on Mars?

I would start some sort of communications platform. So one of my great, I guess, business crushes is Evan Williams who created Blogger, then Twitter, and Medium. So that platform is really, really amazing. I imagine language barriers would be an issue. So creating a platform where people can share their stories and it’s automatically translated into English for us, I guess, or the equivalent language of whoever’s there. That would be a priority for me. And then people on Earth who are grappling with climate change can write and share those stories and be inspired to come to Mars and escape the madness of Earth.

 

Get in touch with Fleur

Fleur on LinkedIn

Fleur on Twitter

Fleur on Facebook

Transcript

Brendan Hill:
Hello, welcome to the show.

Fleur Brown:
Thank you, Brendan. Great to be here.

Brendan Hill:
Thanks for coming in. Obviously an amazing bio, lots of things that you can teach to small, medium businesses and early stage startups as well. One of the things that really caught my eye is your work with personal branding. So when did you realize that personal branding was such a strong thing in business?

Fleur Brown:
Yeah, that’s an interesting question and just going back to the bio. Thank you for that. Part of the core work that I teach in personal brand is how to write a bio. So, that’s an interesting question. I don’t know if I have like this sort of moment in time. However, I guess for the last two decades I have done really deep work with businesses of all sizes, and startups. And the common denominator was always the people, the leaders. And I realized that I can’t actually promote a brand very well unless you have a leader who’s prepared to step forward and be visible.

I’ve also done work with quite a few celebrities. I have a television background. And so the common thread through my career was really working with individuals to grow a company message using a human face. And then I realized, you know, it is really all about the human face. And then when social media really came into its own a few years ago, it was obvious that the driver for traction on social media is always a person. You have a company brand sitting in parallel to a leader’s brand who works for that company. And most of the time the number of followers and the engagement is off the Richter scale for the individual versus the company itself. So personal brand really drives the modern form of communication, particularly in the digital space.

Brendan Hill:
And I noticed on your profile as well, someone that is very visible when building their company, Richard Branson.

Fleur Brown:
Yes.

Brendan Hill:
So you had the chance to work with Sir Richard?

Fleur Brown:
I did, he was my corporate crush. That’s one thing off the bucket list. A few years ago, he came out to launch an initiative called the Carbon War Room, which was part of the Virgin offshoot companies. And I was working with the group that was promoting and taking ownership of that initiative in Australia. And they brought him out of course to launch that program. So yeah, it was exciting to have that opportunity. And we also worked with the, I guess the original personal brand it-girl, which was Paris Hilton, some years before. And it’s funny because I remember the two of them meeting in Icebergs, in Bondi, and they sort of had this mutual respect. I thought, well they should because they’ve both been really iconic when it comes to using the power of their personality to meet their own objectives. Yeah. And Kim Kardashian was out there for that tour as well, but she was quite unheard of at that point.

Brendan Hill:
Right. Still working on her personal brand?

Fleur Brown:
She was hanging out with the right person because she’s with Paris and I think she learned a few things from Paris.

Brendan Hill:
Interesting. And, obviously personal branding, it’s a great way to differentiate your business as you said. So how can the guys listening to this podcast now, how can they start their journey on personal branding?

Fleur Brown:
Yeah, sure. Well, look, the great thing about running a small business, having a startup, particularly if you’re the entrepreneur, is you don’t have to work very hard to find your personal story and connection to the business. Something I’ve found working with hundreds and hundreds of entrepreneurs over the years is that the formation of the business always relates to them solving a problem that they had personally. Or an aspiration they had personally. So their backstory is the business backstory. And that’s really helpful because one of the main principles of personal branding that really works the best in any forum, whether it’s a public speaking event or social media or writing a book, is your series of personal stories and what you’re passionate about and how that relates to what you’re actually selling or telling. So for a business owner, the reason that they started the business is something that usually is quite eternal with that business. They may change their products and services, but the reason they’re in business is quite a strong thematic. And if you’re not the entrepreneur, but you are the manager of that business, no doubt you’ve picked that up as part of the company culture. Something Richard Branson’s really amazing at doing is imbuing his own cultural ethos right through his set of companies and I’m sure business owners who are really passionate about why they formed the company will do the same thing. So identifying that theme and the reason that you’re in business and basing a lot of content around that kind of thematic.

So an example of that might be someone like Nick Molnar from Afterpay. Afterpay is quite a successful brand that not without its share of controversy, but that’s what happens when you get big. But Nick was really clear on why he started the business as a millennial and he really targeted the millennial customer base. And he was solving a problem for them. And he stayed very true to that kind of focus in a lot of his communication. I know LinkedIn recently endorsed him as their top business influence, I think, in Australia. And a lot of the content that he was putting out there related, it was going right back to the roots of that company and why he started it. He stayed really true to that. So I think identifying and getting in touch with that original thematic and building a content plan around that is really powerful for you.

Brendan Hill:
So the business owner, they want to build a content plan, but it’s hard to measure the ROI of personal branding. What are some easy ways that they can get started?

Fleur Brown:
Well, I think the fundamentals that I always work with is firstly you’ve got to want to be visible. So I run a lot of workshops and work closely with a lot of individuals in the space who are not celebrities or CEOs. They’re just everyday professionals or they might be entrepreneurs. There’s a huge reluctance, particularly in Australia, to actually embrace having a personal brand. It’s a bit cringe-worthy for people. They feel like they’re kind of might look like a dickhead, excuse my French. So half the battle is just being willing to go there and to be visible and to actually have something to say. Part of that is choosing the channels that you’re going to work on. So if you are a company that’s marketing to other businesses, you can’t look past LinkedIn.

It’s an excellent B2B channel. If you are marketing to consumers, then you’re going to pick more consumer social channels. You also need to pick a mode that works for you. So some people just are not writers, they don’t enjoy the process, they feel very self conscious, it’s agonizing for them to write things. So if that’s the case, you don’t torture yourself by trying to write these long blog posts. I think you might outsource that or you work with something different, like video, or a podcast, or perhaps the speaking circuit is something for you. You might organize smaller events, that kind of thing.

Brendan Hill:
I remember Seth Godin always says, “If you write how you speak, you’ll never get writer’s block.” So there’s definitely a channel for everyone out there, I think as well.

Fleur Brown:
Yeah, there is. And not everyone has to do lots and lots of writing. Writing’s quite fundamental to a lot of different marketing opportunities, but you don’t have to write really, really long pieces or chain yourself to the desk doing writing.

You might be a great natural presenter, whereas other people are really scared by that. So it’s kind of finding the mode that you have. I always say to people, the fundamentals are… Or if you’re a startup, your minimum viable brand is that you need to have a decent up-to-date photo, with eye contact.

Brendan Hill:
So not your Facebook photo.

Fleur Brown:
Not your favorite wedding shot, or the shot with you with your ex-partner and they’re cut them out of the photo, or you’re in a helicopter. Sort of slightly more… It’s got to be a clearly visible… Photo’s all about trust. You need to be making eye contact, you don’t have sunglasses on. It’s showing your face so people recognize you. And a recent photo so that they don’t do a double take when they actually see you in person.

So a decent photo and a decent bio. So what’s a bio? It’s a five paragraph description of who you are, what you’re focused on, what you’re passionate about. I’ve got a little cheat’s guide to writing a bio on my website if anyone wants to look at that. That bio is really important because it’s how people describe you.

We’re all time poor and lazy. And so even big event organizers… Say you’re turning up to speak at something, they’re probably going to just take your bio from your LinkedIn profile or something and literally read it out.

Brendan Hill:
Yeah. That’s what we do here on the podcast sometimes.

Fleur Brown:
Right. So, or if you’re on a panel, they might ask you to introduce yourself. Now that’s very common.

So what are you going to say? Gone are the days that people are doing that thinking for you.

They’re doing introductions. It’s like a free ad for you. So have a think about how you assemble that information about yourself. And have that written down somewhere where it’s easily accessible for people who are going hunting for that content. They might be introducing you to a business opportunity, or a career break, or something like that. They’re going to go looking for an easy description of who you are that they can use when they’re making that recommendation to someone else.

Brendan Hill:
And what were a couple of the points on the cheat sheet if you can remember them?

Fleur Brown:
Yeah. So, you don’t bury the gold. So make sure that in the first sentence or two, it’s really clear what you’re doing currently. We don’t need to know what you’ve been doing for the last 15 years in your career until we get to the point of what you’re doing now.

A little paragraph. If you’re running a business, it’s appropriate to describe what your business does. And really describe it because we have all our industry jargon and our cute way of saying things, but unless it’s super clear, you’ll find that people won’t actually recommend you because they’re not clear on what you do.

Or they don’t know how to describe it. Or they won’t purchase from you because they don’t really get what you’re saying that you’re doing. So really super, basically clear, description of what your business does and what it offers. Stating the obvious in some ways. And then a little glimpse of your passion. So, that’s where your backstory might come in. Like, why were you the person that invented the toothbrush? What was the driving force there? People like to connect with the real person.

Brendan Hill:
And what about injecting your personality into your bio? It’s a big theme I’m seeing on LinkedIn at the moment.

Fleur Brown:
Yeah. I think you absolutely have to be human. And other things I talk to people about is, in your social media recipe, if it was a pie graph, a good percentage of that would just be everyday human relatable stuff. You’ve got to be a human, not a robot. You’re not a spam bot, you’re not there to just broadcast your sales pitches to people because you just lose people.

So showing who you are as a person, things that you’re passionate about and you love doing, that’s important. But choose the right content for the right channel. You don’t want to be showing you your kid’s high school graduation on LinkedIn, or what you had for breakfast. It’s a professional channel. So just kind of being cautious with that. But yeah, absolutely, showing your personality.

In terms of the tone and the way you use language, I have this debate with people about whether they should be first person or third person on their bios and LinkedIn. And I always say, “Whatever you want is fine as long as it doesn’t read like a CV.” Because frankly, no one wants to hire someone who looks like they’re job hunting anyway. And it’s just boring, it’s tedious, it’s just kind of a list of where you’ve worked. You need to kind of thread information together. But keep in mind that if it’s not third person, people can’t just lift it and use it. They’ve got to do some heavy lifting themselves and kind of reworking it into a third person description of what you do. So yeah, you can go either way, but just keep that in mind.

Brendan Hill:
I think this is a good segue into presenting. So I know you’ve done a lot of work in presenting. One of the founders of TEDx, in Sydney. So how does presenting relate to personal brand?

Fleur Brown:
Well, I think in our career and in running a business, there are many times we will need to have presenting skills. So, for example, in the early stages of building a startup, the first 12 months is often almost a full time job trying to pitch for funding. And at the end of the day, pitching for funding is all about presenting. And it is actually all about practising. If you are a CEO or an aspiring leader, you will be asked to speak. And you need to even just inspire your staff. So even just having discussions with your staff. A lot of us have to create business partnerships as part of our business development. You’re negotiating, you’re pitching, you’re pitching a proposal. So these skills are really important.

And if I go back to my own career, when I started my business, I had a business partner who was incredibly articulate and I was quivering in the corner, kind of scripting myself up the Yazoo before I went into even a client meeting, which was insane. So I did a few things. I went to theatre sports just to kind of lose my fear of being in the moment. That was great. Eventually I did stand up comedy. I was awful. But it was a really good experience because I realized that practice is gold.

I’d always avoided practice because I was one of those people that thought that you just run with the adrenaline. That kind of contradicts what I was saying about scripting myself. But when it came to public speaking, I sort of felt like there was an adrenaline rush that helped you on the day. And that’s true, but that you should use that for your audience engagement and your X factor. But not to remember what you’re saying because when you’re standing up in front of people and you can’t remember what you’re supposed to be saying, or your eyes are glued to your notes, or glued to the screen, really not engaging with people… So I learned that practicing is really important as well.

Brendan Hill:
Amazing. And can you tell us a bit more about your time at TEDx?

Fleur Brown:
Yeah, absolutely. So I guess like many people, I was a big fan of big TED. I’ve gone over to the event myself. And at that time in Australia, I think I felt there was a few of us kind of feeling that it was a bit cringeworthy that we were always willing to take these speakers from overseas and talk about them in revered terms. And yet, in Australia we had this wonderful ripe talent that we weren’t putting on stage and we weren’t putting a platform beneath them. So I guess there was a few of us kind of thinking about the idea of having a TEDx event in Australia. I don’t think there were any TEDx events when we started.

Remo Giuffré was probably the person giving the greatest focus to that at the time. Remo had been to, I think, every single TED event ever. He was friends with Chris Anderson, amazing connection to big TED. And then there were a few other people who were kind of having chats with Remo. And then I was having chats with someone else and someone said, “You need to connect with Remo.” So there was a team of five of us, I think five or six, at that time that decided to back in TEDx Sydney. Remo took the license and we got it started as a small and beautiful thing.

And it was a really amazing experience across the first five years of building it because it was a great example of just having the self belief to imagine that it’s going to get great. Because when we started it, it was a beautiful little event, but a lot of people… I’d be on the phone to media, or to partners, or other people and they just didn’t know what it was. So you just kind of had to really stick to your faith in terms of believing that this could be big. And of course now it’s huge. It’s now 5,000 people. I will say it’s been sustainably funded and it’s launched the global careers of a lot of speakers. So it shaved all of those original objectives and then some.

And then the other thing that was an amazing part of it was the team of volunteers. I’ve lost count of how many volunteers now work at TEDx Sydney. But think about that influence. All those people that get to be part of a community that’s there for positive social impact. There’s now thousands of people in Sydney who’ve had that experience. And then the ripple effect of that. They’ve all gone on to do really interesting community things. So it’s a really great breeding ground for positive community impact I think.

Brendan Hill:
So there’s been many business books written about TEDx talks, how to give a talk. Are there a few tips that stand out that everyday business owners can use?

Fleur Brown:
Yes. I think if you look at TED talks, as many of us do, you’ll notice that there’s very few excellent speakers in a technical sense. A lot of people who have stood on the TED stage or the TEDx stage had been plucked from the back room somewhere. They might be a scientist madly working on some incredible invention, or the people that aren’t normally necessarily in the spotlight. So they’re not the most polished speaker. So it’s really not about that.

I remember seeing this speech from this woman who was the mother of one of the Columbine shooters and you can imagine how challenging it was for her to stand on that stage. And she was shaking but you didn’t notice after a minute because you were just captivated by what she was sharing. So really I think the fundamentals are that you need to be an expert. So you don’t talk about things you are not an expert in. And that there’s mostly experts on stage, passionate about the topic. The passion cures a multitude of technical evils. And also the audience just forgets you might have awkward body language or whatever, but they forget and they forgive because you’re so passionate and you’re an expert in your field. So I think those are the things that just kind of add that x factor for speakers.

Brendan Hill:
And for business owners that are looking to engage with more speaking opportunities…because as you mentioned, they’re presenting every day, phone calls, sales meetings, meetings with their staff, pitching to investors potentially. How can these guys start to practice and get on the speaking circuit?

Fleur Brown:
Yeah. Look, practicing out loud is really helpful and that’s something I learned through the standup comedy experience. I’ve written hundreds of speeches for other people in my career and I always used to stand at the back of the room and sometimes cringe if they hadn’t actually read them out loud before they got on stage. Because the written word doesn’t always translate very well into spoken word or it doesn’t sound like you. So practicing out loud is really important.

I’ve actually just started a little venture called Talk Club to give people a chance to practice in front of a friendly audience. It’s sort of like a toast mastery thing. So we had the first one the other night and it went really well. But in terms of getting on the so-called speaking circuit, I think my advice would be, approach event organizers of events that you’ve been to. So the low hanging for you are the events that you’ve enjoyed attending and you’ve kind of got a feel for what they’re looking for. It’s easy enough when you’re in an event to approach the organizer and just sort of say, “Look, I feel like I have something useful for this audience. Would you be open to me speaking.”

And then, do practice out loud, do bother your friends, family, and colleagues for a little practice session. Because that just means your performance is going to be so much stronger on the day. And then do promote the fact that you’ve been speaking. So use a channel like LinkedIn to tell people that you were talking because sometimes there might be 50 people in the room, but there’s 500 people on LinkedIn that see that.

And more breeds more. So when you speak, other people think about you as a potential speaker. And then the last tip I would say is, if you don’t like what’s on offer or you are struggling to actually get those opportunities. Create a forum, do it through partnership. There might be a group of four or five of you who have something to offer to the same type of customer, combine your customer bases and run a little event. Everything starts small. TEDx Sydney started. It was tiny and now it’s huge. So when something works there’s no problem with it being small. You can grow very gradually and beautifully from there.

Brendan Hill:
Awesome. And can you tell us a story of a time when you gave a talk at an event and there was some kind of amazing opportunity that came from you? I guess getting out of your comfort zone in the early days, giving a talk and connecting with a new audience.

Fleur Brown:
This will be one of those long pause moments. I’m just thinking back with horror to the times when I used to give completely written out speeches. And just these awful moments when you’re speaking, when you just sort of think. You lose your navigation and you can’t quite catch up. And you’re sort of trying to keep words coming out of your mouth while you’re madly scanning the page to try. But we’re just in a totally different world now. Vulnerabilities are in fashion now. And no one does that full scripting thing, which is great because your audience connection is so much better.

So back to your question because I was just killing time there. Amazing opportunities out of speaking. Well look, I do a lot of speaking with Zambesi, which is an expert platform for people to learn things. And so I’ve spoken on topics like the future of work and personal branding and that sort of thing. And I think the thing that people I work with often tell me, and certainly, it’s been my experience, is it’s not just who’s in the audiences, it’s who’s on the panel with you. So quite often you have this kind of amazing rapport with other people that are speaking with you. And you end up going into kind of business ventures or business partnerships with them even, from that connection that you have on stage together and kind of getting inside each other’s thoughts.

So yeah, what springs to mind for me is doing a few of those panels and then going on to do collaborative ventures with some of those people. Yeah, I’d have to ponder that further. But I think the other thing that I’m about to do because I’m about to publish my book, is get out there and do more talking. And I think that a speaking platform is a really great opportunity to promote a book, for example, because quite often people want to do business with you on an individual level and you just don’t have capacity to do that. Like I work with a lot of companies rather than individuals most of the time. But a book is a great way to kind of go all, “Here’s a lot more about what I was saying. You can kind of self navigate through that content.”

Brendan Hill:
Interesting. So can you tell us more about the book and what’s the title?

Fleur Brown:
Yeah, sure. So the book title is The Business of Being YOU. And the book is really my, I guess, manual for people to build a personal brand. And in the case of your audience, personal brand that will help promote their business interests. So it goes through all the different scenarios that you might encounter in building a brand from, dealing with media, to getting on the speaking circuit, to getting your social and online presence in place. Plus the mind traps that stop you doing it in the first place.

Brendan Hill:
So The Business of Being YOU, I’ll definitely check that out.

Fleur Brown:
Thanks Brendan.

Brendan Hill:
And what was the inspiration for the book?

Fleur Brown:
The fact that I didn’t feel like a legitimate writer without publishing a book. And also just writing is incredibly clarifying. People will find this when they write blog posts and things kind of get the meat of your subject and understand it better. And also I just had so much content I wanted to get out there on the personal brand stuff. The only way, the only vehicle I could kind of think of to put it out there was a book, kind of like a manual. It’s globally relevant. So hopefully Amazon will be a good tool for getting that out there as well.

Brendan Hill:
Yeah. Definitely list Fleur’s book when it’s released in the show notes along with anything else we’ve mentioned today. And now breaking it down to a more personal level. So besides your standup comedy career, what else are you struggling with in business at the moment? hat’s in your business black box?

Fleur Brown:
Yeah. I sort of started talking about people having a portfolio career a little while ago and how that’s a good thing. And I have a portfolio career. And I’m struggling because I’m trying to get up about three ventures at the same time, and promote my book, and keep my business wheels on. So one of the things, I can’t go into full disclosure on it, I’d love to, but it’s just a little bit premature. So one of the things I’m working on is business TV related. So I’ve until recently been working on a program called Entrepreneurs where we interview, through panel style, a bunch of entrepreneurs talking about specific spaces like space tech, or future of work, that sort of thing. So as an evolution of that, we’re working on a much bigger business TV concept. And what I’m struggling with is just finding the time everyday to give enough love to that because it’s quite time-sensitive. And this is something I struggle with a lot. I love juggling.

Brendan Hill:
Right. Multitasking.

Fleur Brown:
Yeah. I really enjoy it and I feel weird when I’m just doing one thing. So that’s fine, but in order to actually make things work, they need a lot of love. As anyone who’s started a business or a startup knows, like there’s five years of love in getting any venture really, truly, magnificently off the ground. So I struggle with giving it enough time to succeed. That’s my battle at the moment.

Brendan Hill:
Right. And how would you overcome that if it were in a perfect world?

Fleur Brown:
Someone would just put a couple of million dollars a month and then I would down tools in some areas and focus really on those other things. No, I think probably I need a Time Coach. So if anyone’s listening to this and they want to come and work with me, I’d be ecstatic.

Brendan Hill:
Yeah, I know we did have a Time Coach on an early episode of the podcast and he does a time audit for small and medium businesses. So definitely link that in the show notes as well.

Fleur Brown:
Okay. I will check out Mark’s work for sure.

Brendan Hill:
So speaking of tools, in the last sort of 12 months, have you made any good investments in any marketing and or business tools that have really helped you?

Fleur Brown:
Well, investment is probably too strong a word because it’s not a big investment. It’s free, actually Slack channels are great. All my clients use Slack. So for those who are not familiar with Slack, it’s a communications channel and you can have multiple channels for different purposes. And then within each channel you can invite people into different groups and subgroups. And I guess it’s better than email because there’s just such a great linear track record of conversations and collaborations around particular topics. And it was designed to be really transparent and collaborative. I think it works really well for the next generation of workers. It’s kind of a great tool for them. So Slack has been incredibly helpful for me.

Brendan Hill:
Have you explored Slack groups at all?

Fleur Brown:
Yes.

Brendan Hill:
Any communities that you want to give a shout out to?

Fleur Brown:
Not at the moment, no. Yeah, I’m part of a few but I’m not-

Brendan Hill:
Online Marketing Geniuses. So it’s a community of about 20,000 forward thinking marketers from around the world. And as you said, different channels for each marketing topic and you can see the history of the conversations reach out to people. But yeah, I’ve found it a really good way to meet different marketers from around the world and exchange ideas.

Fleur Brown:
Yeah. Amazing. The other person I’d give a shout out to is a gentleman called Joe Allen who’s been working with us at Tech Sydney, which is a group for tech startups in Sydney. And he worked on the current website that is like a lot of not-for-profit community groups is run by volunteers and there’s not a lot of time or resource in there. So he created a model where community can sell flowed content up to the site, which has been really great because it means it’s more engagement from the community. And it’s just reduced so much time in curating content for that audience. And then that content is then curated into a newsletter. And so the whole equation has just removed so much time and it’s potentially more engaging because the people who are reading the content are actually helping to curate it as well.

Brendan Hill:
Right. It’s a lot of user generated content as well.

Fleur Brown:
Yeah. well, not so much that people are writing bespoke things for that platform, but they are sharing things that they’re rating that they found helpful. It might be a medium post from someone else in the community, that kind of thing. Yeah.

Brendan Hill:
Awesome. And speaking of the written word, are there any business books that you’ve read recently that have really stood out?

Fleur Brown:
Yes. Well Seth Godin’s most recent marketing book, which is really aimed at SMEs, and I think you were referring to it earlier.

Brendan Hill:
This Is Marketing.

Fleur Brown:
That’s right. Yeah. I don’t even know when it was written. His stuff is quite timeless, but for some reason I pulled it off the shelf recently and it’s just so good. It really, really focuses you in on what matters and it resonates with my experience of what really works in marketing. I think it’s great. I also just finished Osher Günsburg’s book, Back, After the Break. Which I found incredibly insightful, as a celebrity writing about grappling with anxiety and also grappling with the highs and lows of celebrity life. So I was fascinated by that because I’m really fascinated by identity and personal brand type subjects. But I’d highly recommend that as a read or a listen for anyone who’s interested in that.

Brendan Hill:
Oh amazing. Yeah. We’ll put both of those books down in the show notes for everyone to access. And finally we have one abstract question that we like to ask all of our guests. So are you ready, Fleur?

Fleur Brown:
I think so.

Brendan Hill:
So you’re on… It’s a long flight so you will be nervous. So you’re on the first flight to Mars with Elon Musk and the first settlers aboard the SpaceX Starship rocket. So what business do you start when you land on Mars and how would you promote it to the new Martians?

Fleur Brown:
This is going to be a long pause one. I would start some sort of communications platform. So one of my great, I guess, business crushes is Evan Williams who created Blogger, then Twitter, and Medium. So that platform is really, really amazing. I imagine language barriers would be an issue. So creating a platform where people can share their stories and it’s automatically translated into English for us, I guess, or the equivalent language of whoever’s there. That would be a priority for me. And then people on Earth who are grappling with climate change can write and share those stories and be inspired to come to Mars and escape the madness of Earth.

Brendan Hill:
Yeah, it sounds ideal. So Fleur, really appreciate your time today and the value you’ve dropped the audience. Is there anything you’d like to say before you go and how can people get in touch?

Fleur Brown:
I just want to say that I think that the value of podcasts is beyond people’s imagination. Like who would have thought that 10 years in or whatever it is since podcasting started podcasts would be going so strong.

Brendan Hill:
Yeah. It’s just getting started as well.

Fleur Brown:
Yeah. And congratulations on putting this really fabulous content out to the communities.

Brendan Hill:
No, thank you. Thank you for coming on. But yeah, really excited to share your story with our audience and you can a catch all of Fleur’s resources, books, and stories in the show notes at metigy.com/podcast. So Fleur, once again, it’s been fun and thanks for coming in.

Fleur Brown:
Thanks, Brendan. It’s been great.

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